Pathology of low working rates (China)

Lingua 5B wrote:


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382396/Workers-Chinese-Apple-factories-forced-sign-pledges-commit-suicide.html


Here is a very sad article; I am not quite sure whether and how much we can trust this source, however, it's certainly something to ponder about.

I can't count the times when I spent my money on something labeled "made in China" and soon it ended up in my garbage becoming totally useless. It's my money, so I keep feeling like someone is joking with me as a consumer. Looking at the story in the article, I can't keep but wondering how can an unhappy, miserable person produce excellent work results? It just goes against basic laws of physics. Not only do those large companies are now moving their production to China en masse, but they obviously also use cheap bad quality materials not caring about their reputation any more, at all.

How can we protect ourselves as consumers, is there a way around it at all? And second, are the people from the article responsible for what's happening to them, or is it all and only someone else's responsibility? Obviously, if they once accepted bad working conditions and low rates, it can go only lower coming to the point we can see in the article.

Lingua 5B wrote:

Just to refer to the expensive/inexpensive thing.

Where exactly did I say that the bad quality made in China items, that I bought, were cheap? I don't really know how much you follow trends, the products I bought are from well known expensive brands, and all are labeled "made in China". And they weren't even close to cheap. Naturally, it soon ended in my garbage. Alternative is nonexisting, more or less it's all made in China now.

They are only cheap to factory owners, they don't really end up cheap to me, as a consumer. I don't mind paying a lot for a quality item at all, but not for trash.

I agree about the item information, but these days they are using all sorts of tricks from avoiding to even name the country of origin, to faking some other country. And we know which country it is in both cases.

[Edited at 2011-12-11 22:53 GMT]

Lingua 5B wrote:


.. I have told you, sometime they will avoid adding the country of origin, or will put some other, say European country instead. You can't really know truly where they came from in such case. Of course I'll avoid them at all costs but if I'm presented with 95% of such products on the market, can you offer me an alternative?

Phil Hand wrote:

Just to repeat what I said recently in another thread - things aren't as bad in these Chinese factories as the figures make them seem. In general, working in a factory (particularly a prestigious one like Foxconn) is a step up, and the wages, though low, are a enough to make a big difference in the life of a family only a couple of steps away from subsistence farming.

The media furore surrounding the Foxconn suicides was just that - a media furore. It's far from clear that there was ever anything wrong at Foxconn. They just had a run of bad luck, and the media jumped on them because they're well-known. They actually provide much much better working conditions than most Chinese companies (Foxconn are Taiwanese-owned), and the media focus on poor conditions there is in part a strategy to deflect attention from poor conditions in Chinese factories (including state-owned factories).

Stella(Brazil) wrote:



I just wonder since when in human history is suicide "a bad luck" thing ...

That 17 people have committed suicide at Foxconn is a tragedy. But in fact, the suicide rate at Foxconn’s Shenzhen plant remains below national averages for both rural and urban China, a bleak but unassailable fact that does much to exonerate the conditions at Foxconn and absolutely nothing to bring those 17 people back.

Out of a million people, 17 suicides isn’t much—indeed, American college students kill themselves at four times that rate.

Ty Kendall wrote:



As heartless as that sounds, it's true. The suicides may not have had anything to do with their working conditions or the factory in question (as Phil suggests). The fact that several of their employees committed suicide is just bad luck for the company's image.

I'm also wondering just how many people they employ and how the number of people who committed suicide compares to this (as a %).

I wonder how many microsoft employees committed suicide, how many McDonald's employees.... basically what I'm trying to say is that a spate of suicides isn't necessarily a damning indictment of the company.

After some research, I found this (extremely) detailed account:
http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/02/ff_joelinchina/all/1





It sheds far more insight than the Daily Mail article (no surprise there). The bigger tragedy here is rubbish journalism sensationalizing unfortunate souls' suicides and implying links to "sweatshop" conditions that have little basis in reality but suit western stereotypes of China down to the ground.